You have to come up with a moral statement made, or a moral action performed by a believer or a person of faith, that could not have been uttered by an unbeliever.
littleoutrage (19 hours ago) Show Hide
littleoutrage (19 hours ago) Show Hide
I didn't know where to send my response to Christopher Hitchens' challenge: Name me an ethical statement made or an action performed by a believer that could not have been made or performed by a non-believer. This seems like as good a place as any.
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I once watched a documentary about a family who had been very religious but, through the torturous, all but church sanctioned molestation of their little girl at the hands of a priest, had rebelled from Catholicism. The father of the family was beyond furious or depressed or outraged and he, despite what he had believed and taught his children to believe, 'sinned' against God and against God's representatives on earth by daring to blame them.
I once watched a documentary about a family who had been very religious but, through the torturous, all but church sanctioned molestation of their little girl at the hands of a priest, had rebelled from Catholicism. The father of the family was beyond furious or depressed or outraged and he, despite what he had believed and taught his children to believe, 'sinned' against God and against God's representatives on earth by daring to blame them.
I'm not sure if he continues to believe in heaven and hell or not but this man, out of a clear moral compunction, has, in the minds of many and possibly in his own mind, sentenced himself to hell and damnation for the sake of real justice, real morality.
Giving up God out of a sense of moral outrage is an an ethical statement made or an action performed by a believer that could not have been made or performed by a non-believer.
Giving up God out of a sense of moral outrage is an an ethical statement made or an action performed by a believer that could not have been made or performed by a non-believer.
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AlliedRecords (7 hours ago) Show Hide
AlliedRecords (7 hours ago) Show Hide
"Giving up God out of a sense of moral outrage is an an ethical statement made or an action performed by a believer that could not have been made or performed by a non-believer. "
Sure it can. I'm a non-believer and I reject Catholocism on the same grounds. You said he rebelled against the church. That doesn't mean he "gave up God"
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Sure it can. I'm a non-believer and I reject Catholocism on the same grounds. You said he rebelled against the church. That doesn't mean he "gave up God"
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As a non-believer, you don't think of yourself blaspheming against the church or against God because you don't believe in sin. To your mind, your fate is the same whether you blaspheme or not. At least, that's how it is for me, as a non-believer.
This man seems to have believed in sin and yet expressed hatred for the church and anger at God. In his mind, he ran the risk of sentencing himself to eternal damnation (that's the moral action in a moral statement)
This man seems to have believed in sin and yet expressed hatred for the church and anger at God. In his mind, he ran the risk of sentencing himself to eternal damnation (that's the moral action in a moral statement)
Cursing a God you believe in him is a different moral action than cursing a gawd you don't believe in. When I say 'fuck God, fuck the fucking church, fuck the pope', I haven't committed treason in my own mind. When a Catholic says ''fuck God, fuck the fucking church, fuck the pope', (I may be paraphrasing a little) siding with his daughter rather than the gatekeepers of heaven, his action is morally superior to me although I might be the saner.
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